WAS HERE is more experimental than your previous releases. How do you decide which sounds you want to explore?

We just explore them. [laughs] We have a bunch of synths and stuff that we save while we’re writing every record. When we’re going through different sounds me and Stevie [Knight, producer] will be like, “Oh, that sounds cool! Not for this record though” so we’ll put them in the bank. Also just listening to new music all the time because we’re inundated with it constantly and our tastes change all the time. New stuff is constantly coming out and we’re always getting inspired by different sounds.

We’re always trying to make something that people haven’t really heard before, I guess. We never really try to chase trends or anything like that. This album was written across the span of nearly two years and if you’re chasing a trend, the trend is over by the time the album comes out. We’re always trying to make something brand new and blend what we’re really good at and what we know people like from us with some new shit and try to make something unique that’s fresh for people.

It’s exciting for you too. It’s not just the same four chords.

It is inherently selfish, I will admit. [laughs]

You have to keep that artistic freedom!

Exactly! I don’t wanna be playing the same shit for my whole life. I’m already sick of some of the songs! [laughs] When people say things to us like, “Oh I hope you guys play ‘Lavender Bones’ or ‘Coffee at Midnight’!” we’re like, “Ugh, obviously we’re gonna but we’re not happy about it”. We have to play it so much. But at least people like it. I cannot complain. We’re not gonna Radiohead people and not play the songs people wanna hear.

You wrote and recorded the album a couple different places - Los Angeles, Manchester, and on tour in Australia.

We wrote it. A lot of the vocal takes were just the ones we had from the demos. We do try to record as much as we can while we’re writing but the actual recording technically was done in January or February of this year over something like 4 weeks. We just smashed it out. We were like, “Ok, we’ve gotta get it done”. [laughs] Obviously we had singles come out before then and we had to prioritize songs. It was all kind of done at the start of this year.

For the writing process did you feel like any place had a really big impact on your music? You mentioned that “Sex on the Beach” was influenced by Los Angeles.

The content of that song was definitely inspired by that. I feel like such a fake bitch because I wrote that song about how fake LA is and how I hated it and now I’m moving there this year. [laughs] LA is great, I won’t hate on it but there are definitely douchebags that live there for sure.

I feel like the place that had the most impact for me personally when we were writing was Manchester. Me and Stevie got an Airbnb in Manchester and I was not writing and I was really scared going into that month as well. Normally I’ll write lyrics down every now and again and I’m always thinking of stuff to write about and what I’m feeling, but I had nothing going into that place. It showed when I was trying to write lyrics and they weren’t coming out the same way that they normally would. I wasn’t writing about anything that was real or relatable and it was all very surface-level bullshit. Stevie pulled me aside - I say “pulled me aside” but it was just us two in the Airbnb - and he was just really real with me like, “Dude, this is not what you’re capable of and this is not normal for you. Is everything ok? What’s going on?” I just broke down. Just based on all this personal shit I’d been going through the last few years in particular, I didn’t realize I was numbing myself so hard. It made me realize why I was feeling so isolated from my own friends and felt like I couldn’t share my feelings as much. This was very, very telling because I’m not very good at showing my feelings but I will always put that into the music and that’s how I deal with stuff but I couldn’t even do that.

It made me face a lot of shit that was happening in my life. I really had to shed a lot of skin and make a lot of changes that were going to benefit me long term even though they were scary. I had to face a lot of bullshit and that was when we started writing properly for the album. Thank god that happened early on, otherwise we would probably have a bunch of songs on the album that meant nothing to me. Thankfully, it meant that I was able to try at least to access a really vulnerable part of myself. I think it really helped shape the album so much more because I was able to be honest with myself and not be a coward and actually face my shit. It was scary because I was so numb that I didn’t even think I would be able to get myself back to where I was. I forgot who I was, I was scared I was never going to be able to feel again. I was like, “Fuck! I’m not going to be able to make music anymore”. I was getting super existential with the whole thing. Thankfully, I’m in a much better place now and feel like myself again. [laughs]

I’m really glad to hear that! It’s a really terrible, terrible place to be in.

Have you been in that too?

Yeah! I do kinda the same thing where it’s like, “Nothing’s going on, everything’s fine!” and then one day I have no feelings or any physical sensation, just nothing at all.

It’s fucking scary! And it’s hard to admit it to yourself at the end of the day, let alone someone else. Admitting it to yourself is the scariest part because that almost makes it real and then when you admit it to someone else, then it’s fucking real and you’re like, “Ugh, now I have to deal with it. I’m forced to deal with it”. Like someone knows now, what are you gonna do? Are you gonna be a coward? They’re not going to forget! [laughs]

What helped you dig out of that?

Well firstly, Stevie being my best friend first and foremost and not putting pressure on me like, “Where’s the goods? Where’s the goods?” He was just coming from a genuine place of, “Are you ok?” I think just by being an outsider on my life and looking in, he knew why this had happened. I think he saw the process of the whole thing. He’s always so supportive of me and having him be there to support me and be like, “Dude, just tell it how it is. How do you feel about this situation? Let’s just fucking write about it. We don’t have to use it”. He really helped me connect back to myself.

I was living in Manchester at the time so I was isolated from my support network and having him there felt really refreshing and really good. Having him support me through the whole thing was amazing. Obviously, the rest of my friends and the band and everyone understood what I was going through and helped too. The main thing that helped was just facing it and dealing with the situation and taking that out of my life. Without throwing shade on people or anything like that, I don’t wanna get into fucking beef, I feel like people might be able to figure out what I’m trying to say without saying it. I’m a fucking slut for putting everyone else before me in terms of their feelings and making sure they’re comfortable. I will put all my time and all my energy into someone and not take care of my own needs so it felt good to actually put myself first in that situation as well.

Did you have a song off the album that was the most cathartic to write?

Ironically enough, “Love U Anyway”. [laughs] I always thought love songs were cursed, that’s why I’ve never really written one before, and this was the first one I wrote. I was like, “Damn, I did that! That’s crazy!” and then all hell broke loose. I was like, “Damn, they really do be cursed! Fuck!” [laughs] I keep calling it “Girl’s A Gun” but we ended up calling it "G.A.G", was really cathartic as well. “Killer Cobras” as well definitely helped. Those three were the most cathartic, I’d say.

“Kissin’ Killer Cobras” is one of my favourite tracks off the album.

It almost didn’t make it! Me and Miki fought for it!

What?!

Dude, I know!! Fuck me dead, I felt like I was being gaslit like, “How do you not see that this song fucking slaps?? What the hell??”

I can’t believe it almost didn’t make it! What’s the story behind the song?

Thank you so much, I feel so seen! I forget the full process of it lyrically - I think it was one of those ones that just kinda came out - but I realized I was almost writing my own urban legend. [laughs] The concept is becoming the monster that created you, almost like a Frankenstein sort of thing. It’s talking about toxic relationships or anything like that. Because you’re in that cycle and you’re so used to being in it, you kind of start acting the same way because it’s so normal, and then you become the thing that you fucking hate and don’t agree with. It’s not celebrating that, but kind of looking at it from a badass perspective - which is wrong - but that’s why I went the urban legend route like, “It’s about this person who becomes a snake and starts killing people!” [laughs] It was super fun to write. I wanted to do a music video for it because I wanted it to be a single. The concept I had was our heads on snakes that were 3D animated and we’d just be slithering around. It never happened but whatever.

It could happen in the future, you never know!

It could, it could.

On “kill[h]er” you’re talking about battling self-doubt and how so much of that kind of self-loathing has been conditioned. What do you do when you feel that self-doubt creeping in? How do you break that conditioning?

I don’t, I just deal with it. [laughs] I try to compartmentalize it or even though it’s a part of me, I try to look at it from an outsider’s perspective. I learned that in therapy. My therapist was talking about how you have different parts that make up you - it’s not just one part, there’s so many other things - and the self-doubt thing is something that I know I have to live with. I’m trying to get past it and I think little by little I am, but I’ll always have it. Then there’s also that fucking toxic thing in your head that’s like, “If you don’t have the self-doubt and the imposter syndrome then maybe you’ll think you’re the shit and won’t write anything that’s cool or meaningful”. I’m tossing between them all the time. I think it’s important to have a little bit of it just so you don’t become an egotistical cunt. I definitely struggle with it a lot but try not to let it affect me creatively anymore.

On “WARZ0NE” you’re calling out people who post hateful comments online. What’s the best way you’ve found to deal with those trolls?

When you know you could rinse them in an argument about what they’re saying because you know they’re so fundamentally wrong, it is really, really hard not to respond. I think the best thing I’ve learned is 90% of the time - well, almost 100% of the time - is that it is not worth getting into it because they’re going to believe what they’re going to believe at the end of the day. A lot of the time they’re doing it just to do it and they don’t actually believe what they’re saying, they’re just being a troll for the sake of it. They’re obviously very sad in some way. I feel like I’m a very empathetic person but I just cannot put myself in the shoes of why someone would sit there and write a hateful comment. I can’t empathize with that. I don’t understand it. I can understand it if you’re 8 years old because we’ve all been there but when it’s grown adults, I’m like, “Grow up and sort your life out”. There’s so many positive comments you can read instead. But it is very hard, very, very hard. They would never say it to your face anyways! They would not. Like, meet me at the KFC car park at 3 pm. You won’t.

Lynn of PVRIS, Amalia of Bruses, Sueco, and Polaris all have guest spots on the album. How did you decide who to work with?

Most of them were because we knew the song would suit them. We were already friends with Lyndsey and Polaris so that worked out. We’d always wanted to work together with Polaris. I’d see those guys all the time when we were out and about because we run in the same circles in Oz. We’d always have a good time together and chat shit and talk about wanting to work with each other or tour together. It never really worked out timeline-wise or with scheduling. We had the song “Criminal” and originally I was screaming in the bridge. Then we were like, “Why don’t we ask Polaris to do it? Jamie’s a fucking freak, he’s so good, and Dan writes sick parts as well” and they said yes.

For “GIRL$”, I’d wanted to work with Lyndsey for a while as well and we became friends on the Sad Summer tour. I was too scared to send her the track. I was like, “I don’t want her to say no to my face! That’s embarrassing!” [laughs] So I got our label to send it to her and she hit me back really quick and was like, “This song is sick!” I was like, “Do you wanna be on it?” She was like, “Yeah!” and I was like, “Awesome!” Bruses I’d known about for a while and I always thought her stuff was really, really cool. The fact that she said yes and sings in Spanish on the track, I was like, “This is so cool! Fuck yeah!” We thought it would be sick to have three queer women on the track, it just hits harder.

Sueco was a wildcard. Never met him, don’t know anything about him besides the fact that he has a cool voice and I like his stuff and think he’s funny as fuck. We hit him up and he said yes too. We were like, “Damn, these people fuck with us, that’s crazy!” It definitely depends on the song and if they’re right for the part and they all were. It’s very organic.

I’m glad everyone saw the vision and came together for it.

Yeah! It was the first time we were like, “Damn, our peers respect us! We are not a joke band anymore I guess!” Even though we are still but… [laughs]

[laughs] The music’s not a joke.

Yeah, that’s true. But we’re definitely clowns.

Screening Shrek and all that. It’d be really funny to message Mike Meyers and just be like, “Hey, can you do the Shrek voice for one of the songs?”

Dude, I’ve even thought about us doing a tour and having the opener be some stand-up comedian instead of a band. [laughs] It would be wild! It’d be such a random vibe change but I’d be so down.

Do you have any comedians in mind or just a comedian in general?

Fuck no! [laughs] I’d be the type to just go to an open mic night in New York City and grab the person who bombed the hardest and be like, “You should do this!” That’s kinda mean actually, maybe I’m a bully. [laughs] Or we could just make it an open mic night every night so we could get local comedians up who want to try their shit out. I’d be so down to do that!

Your video for “GIRL$” is hilarious and the old lady concept is awesome. How did that concept come about?

When Lyndsey hit me up about the song, I’d already had it in my head that if she was gonna do it, it’d be so funny if we were old ladies for the video. There’s three girls on that song and I feel like you’d expect the video to be cool and hot and all this stuff so I was like, “It’d be so funny if we were old ladies”. When we were messaging and I asked her if she wanted to be on it, she said, “I’ll be on it but only if we get to be old ladies, zombie strippers, or something like that” and I was like, “Crazy you say that!” We literally had the same thought and I was like, “This is meant to be”. We both had the funniest day ever, it was so stupid.

Did you have any favourite parts about filming it?

The strippers part was crazy because they were real strippers in a real strip club. We were there at 10 am, dressed like old ladies, and they were all up in our shit. We were like, “I don’t know how to feel about this right now!” I felt like I shouldn’t be there because I was dressed like an old lady and I was like, “Are they having fun? I don’t know if this is a vibe”. But it was so funny and they were all so sweet. It was pretty fucking hilarious. There’s so many photos from behind the scenes of me and Lyndsey where the look on our faces is like, “Help! I’m so confused!” [laughs] It’s funny as hell.

I never would have guessed that it was 10 am!

In a real strip club! We were struggling to find a place that would let us do that and randomly Chrissy, the producer of that video, had bumped into this guy on Valentine’s Day and he was talking about how he owned a strip club. I think the same day she went to the strip club, met up with the guy again, and was like, “Can we sort out shooting the video here?”. He got her a drink and they were in this exclusive section of the strip club doing a business meeting. [laughs] He was like, “How many girls do you want?” The way she told the story was so fucking funny!

You’ll be playing your biggest Australian shows to date later this month and touring Europe and the UK in September. What are you looking forward to the most about these shows?

It’s so frustrating because we have so much crazy, random shit planned for these shows - we’ve never done shows to this production level before - and I can’t give anything away. We’ve got a crazy light show but there’s certain parts in the set we’ve organized to be so crazy and I cannot wait. Especially for the Australian shows, we’ve got extra shit. We’re so excited to play them! I can’t reveal any of the things because I want people to be surprised. I’m so excited!

There’s videos online of people doing shoeys in your pits. Do you have any tips for how to do a good shoey in the pit?

Probably just don’t. [laughs] There’s no such thing as “tips”. I think probably just using a clean shoe would be great. The way I always think about it when I’m forced to do it in someone else’s shoe is, “Surely the alcohol is killing any germs in this right now”. There’s definitely been times when I’ve done one and there’s bits of the shoe stuck in my mouth after and I’ve had to spit it out.

Oh god, no.

Oh man, it’s bad. I probably have athlete’s foot in my liver. I’ve got some weird shit in me. No tips, just make sure you’ve got alcohol that’s very strong so it kills as many germs as possible. [laughs]

Which part of WAS HERE are you proudest of?

The whole thing in itself, I think, just because I went through such heaps of growing pains during it. 17” was not a hard track to write but it was a hard track to convince myself to put it on the album. I didn’t want it on there because I didn’t wanna talk about it, which is fair I guess, but I feel like the more people I talk to about it the more it helps. People were loving the song so much and were like, “It’s such a waste if you don’t put it on”. Then I realized that if it can help someone who’s been through that and help them feel less alone in it, it’s worth it.

I know it’s such a hot topic and I didn’t want it to come across like I was trying to capitalize on this because it happened so long ago and I haven’t written about it or talked about it or anything. I feel like that’s part of the reason why I didn’t want it to be a single or anything, I wanted it to be there for anyone who needs it. If it can help someone, that’s fucking great and that’s the best-case scenario. I was proud of that going on the album.

I was also really proud of part 2 of that song, “17 // REPRIZE”. We were in this Airbnb in Manchester on the top floor of this apartment building with heaps of glass windows so we were overlooking the city at night and it was all lit up. We had all the lights off and Stevie handed me the microphone and I had a glass of wine in one hand and the microphone in the other. We had this instrumental that we wrote and I was riffing over it. The original take with the OG lyrics is the one we used so it was a one-take thing. I’m really proud of that. I didn’t realize I could do that and I guess I did. It was a special moment for sure.

I’m glad you were able to write about it and share your story in the way that you wanted to.

The toughest part for me was being scared that people would think that I was just trying to capitalize on something that’s fucked up but that’s not the case at all. It was just a therapeutic song for me to write at the time and I didn’t even think it was going to be on the album. I didn’t even think anything of it, I just wanted to get it out of my system. For it to end up being on the album and have people fucking with it is really cool.